#FreeBTS
Talisman
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Post by #FreeBTS on Apr 9, 2024 22:09:32 GMT
Now just imagine this the other way round
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Post by The Quito Diet on Apr 9, 2024 22:13:34 GMT
Neuer's leg swings out too. I genuinely don't understand why that isn't given. ‘Neuer’s leg swings out’ is an interesting way of viewing that video Never a pen, would be absolutely disgraceful if that was given Second replay literally shows Neuer swinging his leg out. Saka's clearly ran into him but Neuer makes enough of a movement to make it a penalty. Especially in Europe with their laughably low threshold. If that's Kane it's given all day long. Speaking of, I cannot believe he didn't see red for blatantly elbowing Gabriel.
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Post by The Quito Diet on Apr 10, 2024 7:40:33 GMT
Now just imagine this the other way round Question on this as I hadn't considered it until just now. How is this any different from throw-ins where a player shapes to take it before chucking it underarm to another player. Should those not be given as foul throws or handball if we're following the letter of the law strictly? Fully understand why it should be a penalty. Couldn't have complained if it was given.
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Paul
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Post by Paul on Apr 10, 2024 9:07:52 GMT
The way that’s clipped I can’t tell where the ball has come from? Is it Raya giving it to Gabriel or Saliba?
The foul throw thing is that most of the time, they don’t throw it in, they drop the ball off the pitch or throw it underarm to the thrower off the pitch, both of which are fine. If they throw it onto the pitch then yeah it should be given the other way but I’d say they’re relatively minor, a handball in the box is a handball in the box. But we learnt from Odegaard the other month that this is actually fine so nothing to see here
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Post by The Quito Diet on Apr 10, 2024 10:09:33 GMT
I would want to see a longer clip because the one I've seen it looks like Raya is waiting on the ref to do something before he blows his whistle, idk if it's a VAR check or not. So is Raya actually restarting play with the pass to Gabriel or is he just passing it to him to take the goal kick?
In theory, it doesn't matter as the whistle has gone but as with the throw in example, common sense is applied rather than the strict definition of the handball/foul-throw law.
Also what we've learned from last night is Liverpool fans are unnecessarily angry with Saka for some reason, and that most people don't seem to understand what a dive is.
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Paul
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Post by Paul on Apr 10, 2024 10:25:25 GMT
Ok but that is a dive. Neuer being there and whether or not he moves is secondary to Saka jumping into him, away from the ball x.com/thealtcoinglitz/status/1778004948606758964?s=46That’s not a defender dangling a leg to an attacker, that’s an attacker leaping at the defender in a completely unnatural movement away from the ball
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Post by Today I feel Uruguay on Apr 10, 2024 10:56:11 GMT
Isn't the handball one just depend on if the ref considered the gk taken or not? So if he doesn't then what's the issue?
Saka one is never a pen.
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#FreeBTS
Talisman
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Post by #FreeBTS on Apr 10, 2024 11:08:16 GMT
Only saw the highlights, so two things that jumped out from last night. Apparently Dier played well, but the first Arsenal goal, what is he doing? Literally uses his body as a screen for Saka to bend it round? Bizarre defending. Never ever seen Kane take a penalty like that really, but Raya starts moving when Kane is barely halfway through his run up lol, again was quite weird to see.
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Post by The Quito Diet on Apr 10, 2024 11:21:22 GMT
Ok but that is a dive. Neuer being there and whether or not he moves is secondary to Saka jumping into him, away from the ball x.com/thealtcoinglitz/status/1778004948606758964?s=46That’s not a defender dangling a leg to an attacker, that’s an attacker leaping at the defender in a completely unnatural movement away from the ball Again, that's not a dive. Saka didn't exaggerate the contact or feign injury or go down without contact. He initiated it. That's a huge difference. He's gone looking for it, absolutely. He's also been absolutely clattered (through his own fault) and that's, quite literally, not a dive. It's not like he's done a Harvey Elliott and fallen on top of Neuer, he's actively had his leg (that he put in that position) crashed into. It's semantics, but going down without contact or exaggerating what contact there is, is a dive. In the second replay I posted yesterday Neuer also steps out towards Saka - again, enough for me to think it's a penalty despite him looking for it. I just wish the people criticising him for it now had the same energy when I was screaming into the void about Kane/Vardy doing the same thing and yet was repeatedly told it was "smart play".
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Post by The Quito Diet on Apr 10, 2024 11:23:38 GMT
Isn't the handball one just depend on if the ref considered the gk taken or not? So if he doesn't then what's the issue? Saka one is never a pen. Blew his whistle so they're saying the game has restarted. Referee used his discretion BUT also apparently told the Bayern players it was a mistake from Arsenal that he couldn't punish. Which to me reads as if he applied the same common sense as with throw ins etc... Yeah Dier was poor for both goals I think. Coming after he spoke to the BBC to talk up how he should be in the England squad I thought was amusing. And yeah Raya moved way too early, Kane basically aborted his run up to just toe poke the ball in instead.
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Paul
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Post by Paul on Apr 10, 2024 11:43:15 GMT
I’m sorry but semantics aside he literally dives at Neuer’s leg. Initiating contact would suggest he’s anywhere Neuer and just moves into his path, it’s bordering on a foul by Saka with his egregious it is
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Post by The Quito Diet on Apr 10, 2024 12:01:34 GMT
Dives at =/= a dive. Terminology wise you risk then also accusing a player who flies in with studs up as "diving in" and call that a dive. Neuer comes out and moves his leg towards Saka. Saka, at pace, extends his leg to make sure there's contact. And in doing so, makes it obvious that he's done so.
He's looked for it. He's initiated the contact. He's hung a leg out. All fair and accurate. It's categorically not a dive though. By the literal definition.
It's also what has been described for years as "clever forward play", "hanging a leg out", or a player "being entitled to go down over a trailed leg". I have no issue with people saying it isn't a penalty because Saka initiated the contact (even though I don't agree with it not being given). But I take issue with the inconsistency (including my own).
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Paul
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Post by Paul on Apr 10, 2024 12:11:11 GMT
No clever forward play and that are completely different. If that’s not an Arsenal player, if it’s Kane for example you’re going apoplectic at his blatant that cheating is
It’s not as bad as Jota against Newcastle but I seem to remember you weren’t happy about Diaz in that same game going down after being actually fouled. To even think that is excusable is fucking nuts
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Olivier
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Post by Olivier on Apr 10, 2024 12:26:47 GMT
The Saka one isn't a penalty, but you see them given all the time. IMO, if anything he's fouled the keeper.
The handball one is a penalty, but you never see them given. This is a pet(ty) hate of mine all the time with free kicks when the ball is stationary ready to be kicked, all players are set, ref is witing for it to be taken and a taker will give it a little flick forward. Always want an opposition player to just run in and boot the ball away to make the point.
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Post by The Quito Diet on Apr 10, 2024 12:34:04 GMT
No clever forward play and that are completely different. If that’s not an Arsenal player, if it’s Kane for example you’re going apoplectic at his blatant that cheating is It’s not as bad as Jota against Newcastle but I seem to remember you weren’t happy about Diaz in that same game going down after being actually fouled. To even think that is excusable is fucking nuts That's literally why I said I'm being inconsistent myself. I've spent years slating Vardy and Kane almost as a lone voice so to see Saka do the same thing and suddenly see everyone slate him for it and say it's a dive has fully blown my mind. As below, stuff like that is given all the time without much debate and the one time it isn't, apparently it's the correct decision.
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