jaffers
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Post by jaffers on May 29, 2014 0:38:15 GMT
What do you want, bonus points for purposely toning down your own argument?
I've seen statistic that say 2% of rape claims are false, and ones that say 40% are false. Clearly it's neither of those, one is far too low the other is far too high (I fucking hope). They're so hard to categories because of the pure nature of the crime, not to mention the social element playing a different role in different places. Like the % would be a lot higher in certain African countries, than it would in say the UK.
I'm not arguing that it isn't a problem, and that there needs to be a discussion on how to best work at reducing the % of sexual assaults happening and increasing the % of convictions for sexual assaults. However, I'm strongly against doing that by suggesting that the majority of men are going to sexually assault you given the chance.
And don't even get me started of that you bake 100 cookies, and 1 is poisoned are you going to trust your chances enough to eat one bullshit analogy floating around.
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Post by Grant Wahl on May 29, 2014 0:49:58 GMT
If someone were to bake 100 cookies, and poison only a single one, would you eat one?
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Post by Grant Wahl on May 29, 2014 0:55:19 GMT
Like I said, they will use the statistics that best suit their argument by nature. I quoted 60% for the conviction rate for rapists. You're welcome to find a higher number than that. tbf, it would've been helpful if we could see the breakdown of the 40%. like what are the chances that those 40% were down to: (i) false accusations (ii) lack of compelling evidence (iii) judicial system bias towards one gender over another and others that would've been a better picture than just saying, "60% conviction rate for rapists" cuz it made it as if there are 40% of loose rapists running around
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jaffers
Regular
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Post by jaffers on May 29, 2014 1:03:23 GMT
If someone were to bake 100 cookies, and poison only a single one, would you eat one? This is why that doesn't work: It implies if there are 100 guys, and only 1 is a sexual predator, would you trust them? Which of course you're supposed to be like OMG NO! However, when we do this you see how shit it is: You have 100 gay men, 1 of them is a pedophile, can we trust them? You have 100 black people, 1 of them is a criminal, can we trust them? Blanket assumptions are fucking ridiculous.
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allah
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Post by allah on May 29, 2014 1:37:50 GMT
What do you want, bonus points for purposely toning down your own argument? No, I'd like you to act like I'm not trying to pull to wool over people's eyes. I had enough of this argument when I said it was disheartening to see people talk about false rape accusations whenever rape is bought up before seeing the very next argument being individual cases of false rape accusations. I was further pissed off when once again in response to me talking about another topic it was bought up about how other feminists say this and that and the third as though it was what I thought because I call myself a feminist. And then you make two accusations that people use particular numbers to boost their case as though the thing that's cared about is winning a fucking argument on an internet forum. I'm not trying to win, I'm venting my frustration with the world and I know 95% of this forum doesn't care or thinks I'm fucking weird or something, but fuck it I don't give a shit. I don't want points, I don't want to win and I don't want to change your mind out of any particular personal sense of achievement towards myself. It angers me when I see people talk about women in a certain way, and it angers me when I see people try and discredit victims, that's why I'm fucking arguing. Cause I'm pissed off, cause society fucking sucks and the one politician in this country capable of fucking changing anything about it looks like a creep when he smiles so everyone thinks he's an anti-charismatic weirdo. Cause whenever a problem with one group is highlighted the other side of that coin always needs to pop up and say shit. Cause for 21 years on this earth I acted like a self-entitled little shit who would have happily been on the other side of this coin and it was cause I didn't fucking stop and think about anyone other than my fucking self. Cause really, I'm not arguing with you, I'm arguing with the me of two years ago. Your opinion isn't really all that bad, you make a lot of fucking sense all told, you maybe attribute ideas wrongly or exaggerate certain things, but who doesn't? I know you're not trying to make it so that rape victims aren't believed and I know you aren't trying to make the world shittier, but this argument has never been coming from my head, it's not been rational, it's been entirely emotional, it's entirely come from the experience of having to deal with other people going through the shittiest parts of their life in gory fucking detail and feeling helpless towards them. I have literally no idea what I'm saying any more, I just looked at the single sentence I quoted and have no idea how I'm this fucking deep into talking. Although Christ that isn't half a cunty fucking thing to say. 'Bonus points'? Fuck you! If you find any fucking value in what I just wrote you're welcome to respond, but I would in no way blame you if you don't.
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jaffers
Regular
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Post by jaffers on May 29, 2014 2:04:10 GMT
Pull you're skirt back up, grow a set mayne....
First of all - My post about statistics was aimed at SoS, not you. Also you're the one who's fucking brought winning into it. Like that's supposed to be a fucking trump card. Any time statistics are used it's worth not taking them for the exact number, was my only point about it. Now you're getting all bitch made because I pointed that shit out. Angers you when you see women talked about in a certain way? Why, are people making out everyone of them is a rapist? A murderer? Out to get you? Is that some shit not worth arguing over?
Your latter point makes 0 sense 'You make a lot of sense, but I don't like that you do because rape is bad.' Yes rape is a shitty thing, but the World is a shitty place. Is it horrible that rape is a difficult crime to prove, yes it is. Does the fact it's horrible mean that it still be one person word vs. the others the majority of the time becomes an invalid argument? No, it doesn't. The World is a shit place, and that's where a lot of the problem lays. People have this idea they can change the way the World is, and make everything all completely fair. It's never going to happen, it sucks but that's just what it is.
Look in that mirror of yours to you of two years ago, and slap him for being a judgmental prick. Then get the you from two years ago to slap the current you for being a used tampon.
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Post by Disenchanted on May 29, 2014 6:57:43 GMT
If someone were to bake 100 cookies, and poison only a single one, would you eat one? This is why that doesn't work: It implies if there are 100 guys, and only 1 is a sexual predator, would you trust them? Which of course you're supposed to be like OMG NO! However, when we do this you see how shit it is: You have 100 gay men, 1 of them is a pedophile, can we trust them? You have 100 black people, 1 of them is a criminal, can we trust them? Blanket assumptions are fucking ridiculous. Just gonna drop in here that that's a bit of a strange thing to say. 'Straight'* people are just as likely to be paedophiles. *not that liking kids is a 'straight' but I mean in the sense of male liking female.
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Hogan
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Post by Hogan on May 29, 2014 7:35:18 GMT
Disenchanted has something to hide
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Post by Disenchanted on May 29, 2014 7:51:50 GMT
Yeah I have a hidden dislike of awful stereotypes
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Post by localnative on May 29, 2014 8:56:20 GMT
Yeah I have a hidden dislike of awful stereotypes The argument is about awful stereotypes. Think that was the whole point of that post
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Post by Disenchanted on May 29, 2014 9:16:47 GMT
it was more about generalizing than sterotypes wasn't it? ie just because one is likely to be something doesn't mean all of them are.
maybe i missed the point.
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Бенне
Key Player
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Post by Бенне on May 29, 2014 9:18:33 GMT
You appear to be under the misapprehension that things we discuss on here have a point or purpose beyond squabbling!
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Post by Disenchanted on May 29, 2014 9:19:08 GMT
im on pretty heavy medication right now ill put it down to that
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Post by Heung-Min Pleat on May 29, 2014 10:04:48 GMT
im not even gonna start with the last few pages cos i know i'll try and it'll all go straight over my head
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Stu
Talisman
#SparkysOnFire
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Post by Stu on May 30, 2014 9:49:49 GMT
good post Dannyido m8
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