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Post by The Quito Diet on Mar 22, 2014 20:23:57 GMT
Domestic cup semi's and an 87th minute goal in the CL quarters, hardly like we went out early in all competitions and could focus solely on the league was it?
It is overlooked because of the uniqueness of it; you can measure the number of league titles, european titles from club to club, it's a very difficult thing to even begin to place the unbeaten season because not only is it such a uniquely rare accomplishment, it's also nigh-on impossible to compare across era's, or even seasons, without mass debaters breaking out all sort of rhetoric about injuries and fixtures and investments and yadda yadda yadda.
He quite possibly could have done some of what he's done in a different role. But he didn't. He did it whilst maintaining our consistency which makes it all the more impressive.
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on Mar 22, 2014 21:12:18 GMT
I don't really think it's overlooked either, it is what it is. It's always mentioned as Wenger's crowning achievement whereas if Arsenal won a treble would it still be mentioned in the same way? Maybe, we can't know. I'd rather have a treble personally that way you can say you basically won everything you entered.
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Post by The Quito Diet on Mar 22, 2014 21:59:09 GMT
If one of Wengers years had been a treble instead of a double and the unbeaten hadn't happened, I doubt he'd be as well regarded if I'm truthful. Hard to gauge because it's all hypothetical, but an unbeaten season is such a rarity, even moreso than a treble, that there are few teams in history that can match it.
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Post by ange postecoslamp on Mar 22, 2014 22:15:31 GMT
I was under the impression that Bayern haven't lost a game since about 97 and they've only conceded twice all season
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on Mar 22, 2014 22:18:00 GMT
No English team has won the Champions League, FA Cup and Premier League in the same year though, whereas technically two English teams have (Preston as well) but we'll say they're more or less as rare.
Europe-wise, Juventus went unbeaten a few years ago. Porto twice unbeaten. Dynamo Kiev twice and Shakhtar in Ukraine. Galatasaray and Besiktas in Turkey. Ajax unbeaten in 1995. Milan unbeaten in 1991. All since the mid-1980s.
Meanwhile, since the mid-1980s, PSV, Man United, Barcelona, Inter and Bayern Munich have completed the treble. It's a rare feat too.
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Post by The Quito Diet on Mar 22, 2014 22:30:08 GMT
Aye I'm not saying it's not rare nor knocking it as an achievement, I just rank an unbeaten season higher and think it's a rarer achievement. Don't really think you can dig down into the Ukrainian and Turkish leagues tbh, but then we get into semantics of which I can't be bothered to debate.
Aye Bayern are on course for possibly the best season ever, unbeaten in the league, favourites in Europe, not a clue how they're doing in their cups but I imagine they're still in them. Perfect season.
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Post by Maskya Yoshida on Mar 22, 2014 22:32:10 GMT
Shame he's tactically naive isn't it.
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Slim Jim
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Post by Slim Jim on Mar 22, 2014 22:57:05 GMT
Saw today that there's only been one season since the Invincibles that the team that won the league hasn't won more league games than that team. Obviously I know the point is that they didn't get beaten all season but still thought it was interesting that almost every season since the champions have won more games.
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Post by Jooglewooga on Mar 22, 2014 23:13:25 GMT
It depends which way you look at it really. If you take Spain, Italy and England's top leagues you've got 60 teams and thus 60 opportunities to go a whole league season unbeaten, whereas there's only one opportunity to win the treble every year.
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Post by The Quito Diet on Mar 22, 2014 23:25:29 GMT
It depends which way you look at it really. If you take Spain, Italy and England's top leagues you've got 60 teams and thus 60 opportunities to go a whole league season unbeaten, whereas there's only one opportunity to win the treble every year. What?
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Post by Jooglewooga on Mar 22, 2014 23:36:35 GMT
Basically, you could have more than one team going the whole season unbeaten but you can't have more than one team win the treble (unless you count Europa League as well).
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2014 23:47:00 GMT
Domestic cup semi's and an 87th minute goal in the CL quarters, hardly like we went out early in all competitions and could focus solely on the league was it? Well no but I seem to remember Arsenal being very hyped for getting draws come the end of that season when they were out of everything else. 26 wins, 12 draws and 90 points with 'just' a league title to show for it? Of course I'm being harsh but if you think it should get more recognition the only way it is going to do so is if that side is compared to other great teams from the last 10-15 years, for me they don't stack up. Nowhere near. By the same token I don't think the Juve side that did it recently do either tbh, compare those two to Barca, Bayern or United? Absolute no brainer, don't need to argue investments, injuries or whatever it's a non-starter. And of course Wenger would've been as well regarded had he won a treble, he'd have won a Champions League for starters. Success in Europe is where most people start when talking about the very top managers that there have ever been. Again, it's harsh, but if you're going to throw people like Ferguson, Paisley or Clough into the ring then you have to be.
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Exonerator
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Post by Exonerator on Mar 23, 2014 0:35:08 GMT
do you think he'd have the same amount of success in another league
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on Mar 23, 2014 0:57:41 GMT
Wasn't there a Pires dive in a game against Portsmouth to get a draw in the Invincibles season? Have that in my head or something. I can't remember what it was like at all and I've never been able to find a video for it.
Not to discredit the achievement because it was basically a dive that ended their unbeaten run the next season.
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notpropaganda
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Post by notpropaganda on Mar 23, 2014 1:19:02 GMT
^ There definitely was, one of my best mates is a Pompey fan and went on about it for ages
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