Mycon
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Post by Mycon on May 7, 2014 10:56:03 GMT
Cristiano is considered one of the four best footballers of all time and rightly so. Ronaldo doesn't really come close to that tbh. Also at his peak Ronaldo managed 30 goals in a season. Cristiano double that last season. Ronaldo is considered in as much more best player ever lists than Cristiano and I've never really seen Cristiano considered as one of the best four footballers of all-time. There won't be many that will consider him the best Real Madrid player of all-time, look up Di Stefano. Imo what Cristiano is doing at the moment is pushing him ahead of Ronaldo but you can't discount how good Ronaldo was. Hate when people say Ronaldo and Messi aren't doing comparable things, of course they are, everyone thinks that their era of the best but the best players ever argument is full of players with almost perfect careers, it ain't that easy to get in at that level. The fact that people even consider them to be in the top 10 shows how unbelievable they've been.
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on May 7, 2014 11:13:35 GMT
Another good comparison from the two different eras is Zidane or Iniesta? I think they're about equal, Iniesta has won more and is arguably the better player but Zidane had a certain mystique to him that is hard to ignore. Probably because he was France's main hope at a time when they were prominent in world football whereas at Barcelona and Spain, Iniesta is surrounded by other great players. And for those reasons Zidane will always be remembered more than Iniesta but I think it's a close call.
In a specific role as a number 10 in a 4-2-3-1 like he used to line up for France, there may be no-one better at influencing the outcome of a match.
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on May 7, 2014 11:19:46 GMT
You can't compare there performances in international competitions either really. Brazilian Ronaldo had players like Cafu, Ronaldinho, Roberto Carlos etc. Christiano Ronaldo has Helder Postiga. He had Figo, Rui Costa and Deco in his early career. There's enough of a platform there to do things at international level. At the WC too, he'll have a decent midfield, Pepe and Coentrao at the back, they'll have that striker problem but that shouldn't get in the way of him scoring. Portugal have never had bad players, they're not a minnow. They have reached two semi-finals and a final in his time.
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Post by Gianni Infantino on May 7, 2014 11:33:06 GMT
The 2002 World Cup was my first real experience of the tournament and Ronaldo probably made me fall in love with football that year. He'd scored the two goals in the final and then iirc we played Madrid in a friendly that summer and that's when I heard that they'd signed him. He didn't play and I was gutted, but that hat trick against United was superb.
Opinion on Cristiano Ronaldo for me is always gonna be sour. Even though I always knew he was talented, I disliked him because he was one of United's key players. I didn't realise how dedicated he was back then either. He's probably my favourite non-Liverpool player, I just enjoy watching the kind of player who just seems to have it all. Pace, power, quick feet, finishing, aerial ability and the occasional gobsmacking goal. That's why I prefer Cristiano, as Sam said he's the definition of a poster boy.
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Post by Maskya Yoshida on May 7, 2014 12:00:48 GMT
You can't compare there performances in international competitions either really. Brazilian Ronaldo had players like Cafu, Ronaldinho, Roberto Carlos etc. Christiano Ronaldo has Helder Postiga. He had Figo, Rui Costa and Deco in his early career. There's enough of a platform there to do things at international level. At the WC too, he'll have a decent midfield, Pepe and Coentrao at the back, they'll have that striker problem but that shouldn't get in the way of him scoring. Portugal have never had bad players, they're not a minnow. They have reached two semi-finals and a final in his time. The Brazilian team Ronaldo played in is still far better than any Portugese team Christiano has played in. People can't use international achievements as a way to differentiate between the two players.
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Post by ange postecoslamp on May 7, 2014 12:11:32 GMT
Who's Christiano? No national team could ever quite compare to that '02 Brazil squad though, mental. They had Cafu, Lucio, R. Carlos, Ronaldinho, Rivaldo and Ronaldo all more or less at their peak.
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Post by Maskya Yoshida on May 7, 2014 12:15:48 GMT
Fuck off clean shirt.
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on May 7, 2014 12:33:37 GMT
He had Figo, Rui Costa and Deco in his early career. There's enough of a platform there to do things at international level. At the WC too, he'll have a decent midfield, Pepe and Coentrao at the back, they'll have that striker problem but that shouldn't get in the way of him scoring. Portugal have never had bad players, they're not a minnow. They have reached two semi-finals and a final in his time. The Brazilian team Ronaldo played in is still far better than any Portugese team Christiano has played in. People can't use international achievements as a way to differentiate between the two players. Fair enough but at club level you could say that Cristiano played for the possibly the best team that United have had under Ferguson and it's a pretty class Real Madrid team at the minute at club level, better than any club team that Ronaldo ever played for. That includes the Galacticos, who had great players but were a dreadful team.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2014 17:02:53 GMT
Using team accolades to assess individual accomplishments is bullshit in general. But Ronaldo's edge on the international stage comes from performing better as an individual compared to Cristiano, not what they won with their country. Similarly you could argue Cristiano has performed better at club level.
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danielt
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Post by danielt on May 7, 2014 18:25:44 GMT
CRon got Portugal to the WC and is probably the reason they'll reach at least the last 8
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on May 8, 2014 14:05:35 GMT
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Post by Grant Wahl on May 8, 2014 14:19:29 GMT
You can't compare there performances in international competitions either really. Brazilian Ronaldo had players like Cafu, Ronaldinho, Roberto Carlos etc. Christiano Ronaldo has Helder Postiga. He had Figo, Rui Costa and Deco in his early career. There's enough of a platform there to do things at international level. At the WC too, he'll have a decent midfield, Pepe and Coentrao at the back, they'll have that striker problem but that shouldn't get in the way of him scoring. Portugal have never had bad players, they're not a minnow. They have reached two semi-finals and a final in his time. aging figo and rui costa + rather young cristiano, though? cafu, ronaldinho, roberto carlos, etc were in their prime when Ronaldo played alongside him? (not to mention Ronaldo peaked a little bit early too). I personally never see Portugal as a side capable winning of the world cup, anyway. Whereas when you see Brazilians squad from 1998 to 2002, you knew they had a great chance to win it.
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Mycon
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Post by Mycon on May 8, 2014 14:39:26 GMT
There are plenty of players that stand out at World Cups playing for good teams that were never going to win it. Forlan, Hagi, Stoichkov, Suker, Croatia, Bulgaria, Romania or Uruguay were never gonna win the WC but these guys put in Golden Ball-level performances.
I'd say Portugal have better players than all of those teams on paper.
I never said Portugal were better than Brazil, it's just that they're not a bad team so what he does internationally is not irrelevant. As I said the 'platform' is there. I don't think he's done badly either, his international career has been better than Messi for me. He does alright for himself.
If you read the article above, Brazil had come in for a lot of criticism in 98 and Ronaldo was basically carrying the team through to the final. That's why he won Golden Ball. C. Ronaldo has never stood out like that at international level.
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Post by Grant Wahl on May 8, 2014 14:55:40 GMT
hagi, forlan, sucker, stoichkov led their teams in their prime. This world cup is essentially Ronaldo's prime (as astonishing as it sounds lol). he's a much better player than he was in 2010, so he'll definitely have a larger impact. Was unlucky not to be in the final in euro 2012.
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BlueMoon
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Post by BlueMoon on May 8, 2014 20:17:32 GMT
At the moment, still Brazilian Ronaldo but wouldn't surprise me if Cristiano surpasses him when careers are done
Your gonna want to mute it
Something that video made me think, has anyone else played for Barce, Madrid and both Milans?
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